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shred_till_death
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Post subject: keys, minor scales & diatonic modes
 Posted: Jan 17, 2004 - 04:26 AM
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Joined: Nov 03, 2003
Posts: 34
Location: FL
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Ok, so I'm looking at this excercise book (Hard Rock Solos for Guitar by Paul Hanson), and one of the licks is in E minor.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------4-5-7-5-4--4-5-7/9---
---------------------------------4-5-7-5-4---4-5-7------------7------------
----------2-3-5-3-2---2-3-5/7------------7---------------------------------
-0-2-3-5------------2--------------------------------------------------------
etc.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't those the same notes as in G major (in the diatonic modes section of the site). So does that mean I can play the same notes over Gmaj and Emin? |
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Skinny
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 17, 2004 - 10:55 AM
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Joined: Aug 19, 2003
Posts: 59
Location: Northants, UK
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It's all relative...
G major (or G Ionian) is the same as E minor (Aeolian). Otherwise known as relative minor. Find a note a major scale starts on (eg. C), 3 semitones/frets/notes down, and violá, you've got a relative minor.
So, start playing G major on an E, you might as well say you're playing E minor. Start playing E minor on a G, same as G major.
So, original question, yes you could play that lick over E minor or G major. Have fun. |
_________________
MidnightStalker.co.uk
None of that made any sense, did it?
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shred_till_death
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 17, 2004 - 11:08 PM
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| So are there diatonic modes based on minor scales, or are they all based on the major scale? |
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Skinny
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Posted: Jan 18, 2004 - 05:30 AM
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Joined: Aug 19, 2003
Posts: 59
Location: Northants, UK
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| They're all based on the major scale. The minor scale is just one of the most 'well known' diatonic modes. I think. |
_________________
MidnightStalker.co.uk
None of that made any sense, did it?
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shred_till_death
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 18, 2004 - 08:30 PM
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Location: FL
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| So... does that mean I can play diatonic modes over minor chords as well, since even the minor mode is based off of the major scale? |
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bhuether
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 19, 2004 - 03:11 AM
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Joined: Mar 09, 2003
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In my Diatonic Scales lesson, I have a table that shows which modes go with which triad and 7th chords. Basically the way those tables come about is like this: Start at any note in a major scale. Take that note, skip a note, take the next note, skip another note, and take the next note. That is how you make a triad. It is referred to as stacking thirds. If you do this for every note in the scale, you will see there are only 3 unique triad shapes - Major, Minor, Diminished. To find the 7th chords, you do the same thing, but instead of stopping at the 3rd note, skip yet another note and take the next note. In this case there are 4 unique shapes - Major7, Minor7, Dominant7, Minor7b5.
So what we have for mode/chord matchups is (in G Major)
G Major - G Major, G Major7
A Dorian - A Minor, A Minor7
B Phrygian - B Minor, B Minor7
C Lydian - C Major, C Major7
D Mixolydian - D Major, D Dominant7
E Minor - E Minor, E Minor7
F# Locrian - F# Diminished, F# Minor7b5
But I don't like to adhere to modal theory strictly. I prefer to think of moods and similarities. C Major and C Lydian are quite similar so I would use either - both are Major-like. B Phrygian is similar to B Phrygian Dominant (a harmonic Minor mode) so both are interchangeable. Once you learn all the scale ahpes on my site, you will start realizing how similar certain shapes are, and switching will become somewhat unconscious.
later,
brian |
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shred_till_death
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 20, 2004 - 07:24 PM
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| Thanks Brian, I understand things more clearly. What's an "augmented" shape though, I hear that term a lot? |
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bhuether
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 21, 2004 - 02:26 AM
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Joined: Mar 09, 2003
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I think the augmented scale is strictly defined as a scale made by a series of minor 3rd and half step intervals. For example, the C Augmented scale is
C D# E G G# B C
From C to D# is a minor third, from D# to E is a half step, from E to G is a minor third, etc.
-brian |
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shred_till_death
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 21, 2004 - 01:41 PM
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Joined: Nov 03, 2003
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Location: FL
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| Cool. That scale sounds pretty wicked. |
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shred_till_death
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 29, 2004 - 01:24 AM
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Joined: Nov 03, 2003
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| Sorry to bring this thread back up, but I have another question about chord/mode theory. In your above post you showed which modes go with what chords... I know you also said that some non-diatonic scales can be interchanged with the modes, but B Phrygian over a G major chord wouldn't sound good, right? What about if it's a chord progression Gmaj Amin Bmin? In all scale theory lessons I've read it always says "so and so scale sounds good over so and so chord", but backing tracks for solos aren't usually just one chord, they're chord progressions or riffs.. I tend to run through a bunch of modes when I solo, is that wrong? Can you enlighten me a bit? |
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bhuether
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 29, 2004 - 02:21 AM
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Joined: Mar 09, 2003
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Running through a bunch of modes is definately the way to go. I wouldn't worry too much about the theory. If you can solo over progressions then it sounds like your ears are good enough to not need a ton of theory.
-brian |
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shred_till_death
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 29, 2004 - 01:47 PM
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Joined: Nov 03, 2003
Posts: 34
Location: FL
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| Thanks, I guess I'm on the right track. The problem for me with running through a bunch of modes in all solos is that a lot of my solos end up sounding the same! Kind of like a Yngwie Malmsteen syndrome.. |
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